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Brian Laverentz's avatar

I was recently look8ng over the new guidelines and have to chuckle at the criticism of the evidence quality. It would seem that in some cases the guidelines claim a higher strength of evidence than the average physician is appraising the evidence as.

cools's avatar

During Covid when suspected PE on some newly hypoxic pts on vent whose peak and plateaus hadn’t changed suspected PE and even gave one near crashing pt TPA 25mg empirically and the hypoxia resolved so quickly - even got extubated. That was due to resource overload (not getting the cta but still).

Like you said a small minority really is finding success via low dose peripheral tpa - especially versus ekos not sure the ekos has much advantage over tpa.

Glad we might have some data.

The most disappointing thing is what outcomes do we care about? You mentioned as such in the last post the dubious utility of the composite 7d outcomes in HIPEITHO - and the harm signal being real. But what’s a reasonable outcome for the trials we’d desire? 90d pulm htn/cteph or mortality? Or acute clinical things?

We are likely never going to know.

My anecdotal last 2-PE both got theombectomy - neither of them needed it but IR insisted in the “pert team where they seem to be head coach”. One patient had a big catheter hematoma and heparin needed to be held and hemoglobin did drop. The other patient did ok - but he was on room air, breathing at 12 breaths/min, bnp normal, normal bp, Trop downtrended after baby bump but rv appeared large on CT. Pt did ok!

Being this annoying “I’m not sure what we are really giving the pt for this procedure” will not play too well in American medicine though.

It’s likely the future. My only issue is that community hospitals that lack active IR will defer perfectly safe and tolerated low dose tpa waiting for transfer to a center that does.

And for sure that Fri 930pm pt - does IR come in for that?

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